If the Senecas want their casino to be an asset to the community and not just their treasury then this design must be modified. There is no connection....NOT EVEN SIDEWALKS...between this blank ediface and the neighborhood. The landscaping and setback make it clear that this facility stands alone. Hopefully it isn't too late to modify this design. Give us something that says we are connected to the city and the city is connected to us. In some remote site this design might be fine. In an urban center though it is just completely out of place.

I think that this casino could be a win-win. If the casino and Bass Pro do, indeed, drive new development to this part of the city then having all of the pieces fit and work together is vital to all parties. The more out of towners we can get to visit this area the better we'll all be so let's work toward that goal. I think that this worked for Bass Pro and Canalside. We are getting a better project.

Let's stop trying to derail this project and instead work together to improve it. Bring the building to the street and bring the water to the building. As it is now, this is a terrible design error that we'll have to live with for the next 100 years.

I would like to see the Seneca's pay the bed-tax (remember they are tax free) on all their hotel rooms, which in turn would give this area more funds to market Buffalo to outside media outlets. Since the politicians screwed the CVB out of money to market our city's assets, maybe the Seneca's can come to the rescue. I doubt it...but it's a nice thought.

I really don't know what my position is on the casino and gambling in Buffalo but i would definitely echo Texpat10. The design is awful and is completely disrespctful of an urban environment. I only say this as they claimed, or at least so i remember, that this would be a unique casino specifically designed for an urban environment but it looks like every other casino development from Atlantic City to Vegas. It has nothing to do with Buffalo and reflects nothing that would be learned as an urban designer. The "park" is a forecourt not a true park, there is no ground floor anything, the street grid is suburbanized, the parking garage juts awkwardly from the building.. The entire design just looks bizarre.

This might be the single worst designed piece of garbage I have ever seen. I hope to hell that it goes throught the civic and public critique that everything else does. We need something far more urban and nieghborhood friendly.

So, NYC, and TexPat, I have a question or two for you....

I'm going to make some assumptions, and correct me if I'm wrong. Neither of you are undertaking your own $300M+ investments in the city, right? And neither of you are directly responsible for financing/designing this casino, right? Probably not even Seneca nation reidents (Nor am I), right?

So, let me ask you this bluntly, what right, or percieved right, do you have to demand a redesign of a building on private land, paid for with private funds? So, they don't have sidewalks or a park that you like. This isn't private funded, you have no real grounds to criticize. I find you demands filled with a hubris that can only be matched hiding behind a PC. Suburbanization, respect for Buffalo (Which it isn't in, remember), ground floor, doesn't matter. It ain't ours to gripe over.

Personally, I think the building is different than anything we have in Bflo. Much like the Guaranty Building probably was when it was built. Is it the architectural masterpiece Sullivan penned? Hardly. Will it be utilitarian, and represent, the Senecas feel, their heritage? Yes. As such, they should be happy, and build it. They have the cash, the have the final say. Period.

As far as it "Looking like Atlantic City or LV Casinos", guess what... It's a Casino! Are you shocked that it looks like, well... A Casino?

Lastly, as far as my interests, in my 31 years on this planet, I may have spent $150, total in Casinos. So, I could care less if we have one here, or not. I am not affiliated with the Senecas, but I've gotta tell you, I can't wait for this thing to be up.

It looks, well, different than anythign else on our landscape, and dare I say, pretty neat. Different isn't always bad, much like City Court is a great piece of brutalism (Something, dare I say, we'll treasure in years to come... Great verticality, scale and proportions.. But what would I know, right?), too, juxtaposed with City Hall, the BAC, Federal building, etc.

It's about time somebody breaks the complain/sue/redesign/complain/sue/redesign perpetal cycle around here, and just builds a building that appeals to it's functions, and THEIR desires...

-Andy

Hey we're the same age!! also, the design is pitiful. I think I have every right to express that. You can think of it as you wish.

interesting however there was no mention of the lack of the Seneca Gaming hdqrtrs in the latest design, which did appear in the original design. I am curious, did the y decide not to put their corporate headquarters at the seneca buffalo creek casino site?

Bison, The exterior shot in the architectural renderings on the Seneca site is not what they decided to build. If they had elected to build something more akin to that plan then this would be better.

Oldimpala. You are entitled to an opinion just as I am. Cities impose design standards all the time. The argument that because someone has $300mm they can build what they want doesn't hold water. The fact that they are doing this on their sovereign land and can exempt themselves from that process doesn't mean that they should.

In fact, I'd say that you missed my point altogether. A casino designed to fit this neighborhood, or what the neighborhood could be benefits not just the city in general but also the Senecas. As part of a functioning entertainment district each business will provide incentive to draw out of town visitors. They all work together. People don't go to Vegas because there is one Casino. They go because there are 50. And when they get sick of gambling they have other things to do. Is it so shocking to think that an entertainment district where all the pieces work together would benefit all players?

I agree with you that different isn't bad. In fact it is good. Bad designs that give nothing back to their surroundings are bad. This building could and should be unique. I'd love nothing more to see it be the next Swiss Re Headquarters in London or Fort Worth Museum of Modern Art. They are different but oh so good.

I can't believe that you mention the City Court as good design. Right up there with the Convention Center it is the best example of bad "fortress" architecture that Buffalo has. Brutal is right and the scale is completely off.

Great interview. Great information.

Now, let's get the shovels in the ground!

I guess i wouldn't expect it to blend in. It's just a clumsy design.

Christain de Portzamparc a French archtitect has designed a spectacular casino in vegas and it is very urban and has great civic/ pedestrian spaces. It's much larger then this proposal but it is very imaginative and attractive while this is awkward and negates any type of pedestrian environment on the exterior.

http://www.linternaute.com/savoir/portzamparc-s-expose/image/22049.jpg

Pessimism and REALITY - which I am notorious for. The design and location are terrible!

BUT:

The liberals (who I am not against in the particular argument) are going to learn a hard leasson. Every project can not be jammed up in court by Buffalo attorneys that oppose change and development, even if it is the wrong kind.

THE SENECAS HAVE A TON OF MONEY AND WILL ROLL RIGHT OVER THE CITY AND THE COUNTY. They can also tie the case up long enough to build this and make their money back. They will break ground no matter what the law says.

Truthfully, we should have negotiated better terms with the Senecas instead of fighting with them.

Now we are stuck with an awful design in a location that does nothing for the city.

I know more conservatives that are upset with and trying to block this project than liberals. I don't know why this had to turn political.

To the person that said there were no sidewalks, look at the picture there are sidewalks.

bjfan (me too by the way) I meant that there are no sidewalks from the casino entrance to the street side sidewalks. I guess that you have to dodge cars, boulders or mountain rapids to get to the street by foot. I am glad the architects were able to capture what Buffalo was like pre-white settlement with all those boulders and high mountain streams....

Oh and if you don't think a casino can also be urban check out the new MGM or Motorcity in Detroit.

http://www.mgmgranddetroit.com/ http://www.motorcitycasino.com/index_flash.php

Im excited for the casino, im not worried about this city falling apart because of it. Cities like atlantic city that beat up old news, or vegas where the ouskirts are poor neighborhoods loaded with crime were started and put on the map because of casinos. Buffalo is rich with history, art, great food, restaurants. All of which have seen buffalos worst and are still kicking. This casino will just draw attention to buffalo, sure some minor problems may arise but overall in my opinion a positive investment. Also being a small business owner (a neighborhood bar and restaurant) I do not believe my business will be hurt. We go where we like to go. I would much rather eat at a fine steakhouse like fiamma or chophouse, than at the Western Door or any casino restaurant for that matter. My guess would be over half the bookings for the casinos fine restaurants, are compd for high rollers, or players who spend a lot and rack up points are using their points to eat a fine meal. Im not worried about any casino competition. No Casino or big corp can compete with what buffalo has to offer.

Newell,

IIRC, the compact between the State and the Senecas had wordage pertaining to the Senecas spending $X annually to promote the city and its' other attractions. I believe this was basically the answer to not collecting bed tax which would've gone to the CVB. Could you find out more about that?

I think we should stop the casino so the Senecas can move a bunch of their trailer homes up to the site and live there. They can sell discount gas and cigarettes to everyone living in the Perry projects. IT sounds like a win win situation to me.

lol...so i guess the casino should look like a repro historic building? i guess while we are at it the bass pro should be also authentic also and have a saloon on the first floor and hookers hanging out the windows on the upper floors.

TexPat-

I'm not saying you're not entitled to your opinion; I'm saying you're not entitled to demand a re-work of the design. That's essentially what you are/were asking for above; and let's face it, the day we signed that land over to a soverign nation, we lost that right. Period. If it's truly bad design, that'll flesh out in the public response to the casino; people will not visit the shops, floor, and hotel. There are other venues in WNY.

Not to take this on a tanget, I do agree, the convention center is bad design wrapped in a neo-brutalist excuse. It's missing the blank, vertical planes key to good design. The horizontal nature of the building is directly opposite to the style they're protraying, not to mention the dstruction of the radial street grid, stupid sign-board, and millions of other hiccups. City Court, on the other had, is textbook, and was literally IN an undergrad architecture book I had of classic neo-brutalism. It's in scale to City Hall, it's nearly deviod of exterior "dressing", and follows design principles to the letter. I don't like Brutalism, but I do think it's a good piece. Heck, this town, and it's grain silos is considered to be one of the points of inspiration for the movement.. I'm shocked we don't embrace it more...

Now, back to topic... I hope they have a good restaraunt; that's what I do when my friends want to gamble, I eat. That's the best part of Vegas, food.