money should be spent on public infrastucture geared towards making this area a new neighborhood of mixed use buildings on the water, not a destination superstore.

What needs to happen:

1. Aud demolished to extend Commercial Slip to historic meeting point with erie canal- Create boat basin here (adjacent to Main Street on the aud site) Commercial Slip would be twice its current length and long enough to make a "canal walk" with retail and restaurants and a couple small bridges- including one road bridge with lake street reinstated)

2. Skyway demolished to make pacels beneath more desireable, also to connect Pearl Street down to the waterfront (in a pedestrian friendly way- new buildings on former lots occupied by on and off ramps)

3. Design guildlines for all new buildings in the area that promotes mixed use, retail first floor. Zone area to encourage retail - if Commercail Slip extended, zone either side for retail. If bass pro willing spend own money on appropriatly designed central wharf store, they could anchor one end of the commercial slip. At the far end where a new boat basin would occur (which allows boats to travel the length of the slip) allow for a larger floorplate multi-story building that frames the boat basin.

4. Bridge to outer harbor but concentrate development effort for now on erie canal harbor.

Awesome - hopefully this will end the logjam and start full force redevelopment of the canal area. You have to have a lot more than just green space to draw families to that area. You already have plenty of greenspace in the navel park area. Look at pictures of the terminus area a hundred years ago. There was zero greenspace. It was all about density. If we are to accurately recreate a semblence of what was there it must also be all about density.

Hmmm, a basic sustainablility principle is that waterfront development should be water dependant.

Bass Pro really could locate anywhere in downtown and people would go to it, its placement is not water dependant.

If the only thing the ECDHC folks were going to put there is green space(which is a far cry from the original plans), I am okay with some of it going towards a Bass pro store. There is already plenty of green space from the tip of the marina to the area between the marina and the Naval park and also the military monument area.

That being said...if this is going to turn the 30 day deadline into another 6 months(which we know it will), forget about it.

Sorry to sidetrack this thread with research recruitment talk...

but then again the Bass Pro thingy will drag on for another year or two anyways, so what's the big deal.

At this point won't it be best to demolish the aud and redevelop the site from the ground up? I don't understand why the city and county insist on spinning their wheels trying to get private investors to spend millions making the building suitable to occupy. To me it seems that the site would be much more valuable as a vacant piece of land ready to be built upon.

To build on Steel's post, let's ban "green space" from our vocabulary. It is as meaningless as observing that a there is "built space" at the corner of Main & Court.

What kind of "green space" do we mean? An formal English garden? A grove of fruit trees? A jumiper and mulch ensemble? A regenerated wilderness?

When we talk about what we have or want in our city, let's stop being so ridiculously abstract. "Green space" is the worst planner jargon to infect the general public.

this is not happening. You physically can not make it work on this parcel so i would not worry too much about the prospect of this train wreck of an idea. I agree that you do not need as much green space if we really want to capture the feel and character of this area historically, but a store that requires the footprint that bass pro does, with one entrance - maybe they will add one, regardless and semi loading dock access.. just not practical. All those streets are planned as narrow cobblestone strees - how is parking going to work? are the rest of the parcel becoming parking garages or surface lots? and what about all the outdoor display areas for boats and trailors??? it is a bad fit. this is just one more bad idea..(along with the hotel in the hsbc atrium building and something else i can't remember) give it up, bass pro is not coming, they need to get on with it.

A big box on the water?!?!? How stupid can we be????

lol...a joke all the way around. stop groveling buffalo...

Everyone who is against this development saying it shouldn't be given away to some major retail business should look at the past 50 years!!! What's better? A downsized Bass Pro which will attract people to that part of Downtown all year round? Or a stretch of grass with a nice board walk and some flowers and a hotdog stand? I have that in my back yard!!! WAKE UP!!!! If other businesses see the draw that we all hope Bass Pro will become then they will follow. At this time there is no private sector bidding war going on here!! This part of the waterfront is mostly under the SKYWAY, what more can go there at this point? YOU ALL MAKE ME SICK!! Its obvious the Aud was way to expensive. Get over it. Where would you want them to build this alternative plan? In Amherst?

At this point wouldn't it be best to demolish the aud and redevelop the site? I don't understand why the city and county insist on getting private developers to occupy the building. Wouldn't the site be more valuable as a vacant piece of waterfront property ready for development? The city should award the duty of demolishing the building to a local contractor. A clear site would allow development of something new from the group up. They treat the aud as though it is a castle or landmark rich in history. My grandfather is older than the aud and personally I think the building is an eyesore. The city would be better served by a new building when the right develoment opportunity presents itself.

...going on memory here, but I'm certain I read a parking ramp would be constructed between the Marine Apts. and the river, per the Erie Canal Harbor Development Corporation plan, to serve the western edge of the Canal District.

I agree with others that having a development that creates foot traffic on the "mini-park" footprint is much better than turf. Highest and best use of land is needed in that area. So...a 100-200 thousand sq/ft store would have nearby parking as described above, plus other/more I'm sure will be built underground/in ramps.

Knock down the Aud (saving the northern & eastern facades) and build out a convention center from Lower Terrace through the Webster Block. On top of the conv. center, put in retail (a mid-sized mall) and a tower for residences above.

Then blow up the current conv. center, and open up the radial street plan again. Then move over to the Main Place Mall (not Tower) and bulldoze that loser down too.

A few thoughts come right to the top of my head...

Is a 125K s.f. building going to be proportional to the other buildings slated for development in that Canalside neighborhood?

What happens to those foundation ruins that we so carefully and painstakingly unearthed, including all the good work by volunteers?

That whole boxcar $$$ subsidy for Bass Pro will be much reduced, if not elminated, right??? After all, wasn't a substantial portion of that $33MM supposed to go towards Aud remediation and mold/asbestos abatement. The bottom line is the Aud still stands, vacant, and still needs that remediation to turn it into a developable building or ready it for demo.

Ken-- excellent point. Will this turn into yet more wait and see nonsense? Nyc -- props to you too. How much more "greenspace" is really necessary. Period style buildings flush to the water's edge with boardwalks and walkways.

As the zero hour approaches, the next few days should be interesting. Fasten your seatbelts!

It's pretty Fu@#$%^ sad that the only thing visitors to this site ever seem to care about are a bunch of empty fu@#$%^ buildings!

This area needs commercial development. Not green space. Have people been down there. From October to May, its cold windy and you don't want to be outside for more then 10 minutes. Shops, restaurants, museums, hotels. Not a park. We have parks.

Someone from outta of town already wrote this week how dreary it is down there. And theres no where to go after a game or an event. Come March, when the NCAA tourney arrives, theres gonna be that problem again with people finding a place to eat. And the NCAA is going to see this and take the event away.. There goes thousands of vistors and valuable money.

I say reuse the aud. I would love to go back in there again. Some many good memories of the place as a kid. And have some great shops. Why not a giant duty free type mall? Is that possible?

DGard, I just hope the inevitability of building a new convention center is down the priority list, unfortunitly I don't think city leadership has any clue as to how the city should be redeveloped. $66 million to one retailer, seems like a lot of money that could be used on economic development for multiple projects. If a new cc is to be built, why not revisit plans for putting it in the cobblestone district? At least then it's footprint would be out of the way of the "walkable" canal district.

For an article on the realities of a convention center as an economic catalist check out the article on the brookings institute website " Space Available: The Realities of Convention Centers as Economic Development Strategy." Unfortunitly I can't post the URL.

Upon further review, one other thought...If they want to build a smaller store, give them half the parcel the Aud sits on instead of the whole thing. The Aud needs to be demolished either way, so what's the big deal. Just scale back on the size of the store.

coolrobc...in other words the first time the primadonna didn't get his way, the problems started. That is the problem with these researchers. They are promised the world while being recruited and when reality sets in and they don't get their way on every last thing, temper tantrums set in and all hell breaks loose.

AND - release the funding we are providing back to community/economic development - I certainly hope they are not allowed to keep their "incentive dollars." We can use them more effectively elsewhere - and afterall, it's our money.

Looking at the plans previously downloaded from the channel 2 or channel 4 news website, I don't even see how a 100k sq. ft. building would fit in that space.

does anyone know where the proposed location is? Are there any maps that show the area?

Don't get me wrong, I was all for re-use of the aud if it would be viable. It's not, let's move on.

This is a much better idea, it's more in tune with what the store could actually be.

The BassPro in Islamorada is right on the water, why shouldn't the one in Buffalo be?

I think the best news about this is that it won't require the huge infusion of gub'ment money for a re-use project.

Has anyone ever heard of adaptive reuse? Why not use the interesting parts of th Aud (i.e. the fron and the stone corners), gut the rest and build from the ground up. I know its footprint is too small for a convention center, but previous articles this week talked about the lack of class A office space in the city. A new building on the site with the more intersesting aspects intact would be interesting, I think.

Bass Pro is located in many landlocked locations around the country, but I think one of the big reasons they were looking at this site in the first place was the ability to take fishermen out to test the equipment. A six-figure square footage building and a 19th century look are not necessarily mutually exclusive. I can picture a nice heavy timber structure inside the space. But obviously loading dock and parking locations have to be looked at very carefully. Has a figure been reached by the city or Bass Pro on what the current cost of demolishing the Aud would be? I've always been in favor of saving it. With the roof trusses and all the concrete in there I guess using explosives has been considered. But what seismic effects does that have on all the canal work? Adaptive re-use is the way to go here.

Three words:

KNOCK....IT....DOWN!!!!

If the Boston Garden can be knocked down, this monstrosity can be too. I'll wield the first sledge hammer, and I'll do the job for 50K!

Keep the facade, and incorporate it into the new building like Health Now (although I would argue that the old Gas Works facade should have served as the facade for that building, but that ship has sailed). Imagine that facade as the main entrance to a 10-15 story class A office tower, with a 5-star hotel on the upper 5 floors, and a restaurant/nightclub on the bottom floor.

Now, open up your umbrellas, there will be a heaping helping of banana creme falling on all of us shortly....

Ken,

I don't know, something about a top level researcher being recruited from one of the top medical research and care facilities in the world and bringing his company with him to Buffalo seems like a big story to me. I am not sure what that has to do with the other guy being unhappy with his computer.

keep talking about BP but this is the real story today

http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20070112/1055272.asp

We have enough parks in this city and still we try to lure visitor's here. If parks were the answer, we would have been a "Destination" already. So, yes, I agree, build BUILDINGS! ENTERTAINMENT VENUES, RETAIL, RETAIL, RETAIL, RETAIL!!!!!! Mix them together with hotels, museums, theme and other types of restaurants, street performers all year long, street vendors that will sell more than just hot dogs but what about hot pretzels? Popcorn? Pitas? etc? Mix this up and we already have the business district, the HSBC Arena and thier events, the near by Casino (if it doesn't get stopped), the Metro Rail and you have a vibrant new waterfront district!

But from the looks of it, the designes made out, look like a few museums, one retailer and too much empty space that will only be busy during the summer months (2-3 months out of 12?) Which makes no scense if we want this district to be vibrant All year long.

Has anyone thought that maybe there has been no progress for a reason?

I get the feeling that someone/something is holding this project up;

NO ONE CAN BE THIS SLOW AND STUPID.

Even if you did not show up to work for 6 months, there would have been more progress made....

Scratch Bass Pro ( it was was dumb idea from the get go) and knock down the AUD - it is is a useless pile of molded crap

Why must people insist on malls, large stores and convention centers? Has anyone seen the past 50 years of "silver bullet" failures not only in buffalo but throughout the country. Retail is an essential part of the plan, but it should fit into the city context. Instead of malls and big boxes, why not try livable streets with stores people can actually walk to.

Steel - that article you point to is about a researcher moving to Buff not about fishing lures, nets, waist high boots, etc. Is that what you meant?

Don't get me wrong, I do agree with Nick that livable streets are key to Buffalo's revival. However, our current covention center is completely antiquated and destroys our downtown street grid. The Aud offers an opporutnity for a mixed use of retail with a new state-of the art convention facility that can be designed to fit with the overall plan of the inner harbor. Eventually, we will have to build a new center if we want to compete to bring out of town dollars to our area and the Aud offers the option of building a great new facility without disturbing other areas of downtown.

The reason to keep the Aud, contrary to Donn Esmonde's ridiculous claim about its "notorious" inadaptability, is that it is a a clear-span big box with loading docks--already sitting in downtown Buffalo. It is exactly what big box national retailers demand.

We can argue whether we want big boxes dominating the city (I do not). But we're crazy to throw away something that has no existing counterpart in downtown.

If you want to lust after an Ikea (or your favorite big box) on the waterfront, be my guest, but if you demolish their most appropriate habitat, the Aud, you make it inevitable that we'll destroy even more good urban fabric to accomodate their demand for a suburban template: a single use, single story econobox in an ocean of surface parking.

We already HAVE lots of that kind of development for those who prefer it. Downtown should be a haven for those who desire genuine urbanism.

This is probably what Nick wanted to post:

"The overall convention marketplace is declining in a manner that suggests that a recovery or turnaround is unlikely to yield much increased business for any given community, contrary to repeated industry projections. Moreover this decline began prior to the disruptions of 9-11 and is exacerbated by advances in communications technology. Currently, overall attendance at the 200 largest tradeshow events languishes at 1993 levels." http://www.brookings.edu/metro/pubs/20050117_conventioncenters.htm

That is what Steel meant. More high paying biotech jobs moving to the area. Big economic impact and a rise in stature for Rowell. win win

A freind of mine worked for Dr. Skolnick. From what I heard, he left mostily because of technological differences with UB, their servers, and their near complete infelxability (UB and the computers).

She used to tell me stories about him *screaming* about both.

He sounded like a real peach to me, he'll fit right in in Georgia!

Can someone explain to me where the new land came from on the left side of the Skyway near the water in that rendering?

Are we going to create infill there?

Also, I vote to get rid of the aud. I'd like to see a 20 story office/condo building there with an ESPN Sportszone on the ground floor.

One last thought: Can we please stop talking and just DO something? ANYTHING? PLEASE!

Channel 4 is reporting Brian Higgins is going to push hard for the take down of the AUD now for future development. He is also quoted saying the Bass Pro guru Johnny Morris is more in love with the Central Wharf plan than any of his other stores.

The second that Bass Pro goes there, there will be rediculous surface parking surrounding it killing the whole area there.

Unless the funds will be used for underground parking or a ramp between the skyway and the apartment towers. But then people will bitch they have to walk a whole block from the ramp to the store.

Back to Bass Pro...Sharon Linstedt's report in the Buffalo News opens with the information that: " The approximately 1.5-acre site, adjacent to the recently rewatered Commercial Slip, is being eyed for a store that would resemble an original, early 1800s commercial structure. ", but further in the piece it is noted " sources said the shallow, rectangular riverfront site will force a smaller store than previously proposed, probably in the 100,000- to 125,000-square-foot range. " How many early 1800's buildings boasted 100k plus of square footage? That's like saying you are building an ocean liner, but you are going to make it look like an old dinghy. While we are at it, why don't we invite Wal Mart to build a super center there as well, but we will tell them it has to look fifty times smaller than actual size, and go by the name of "Ye Olde Wal-Mart Apothecary".

I would be happy just to see somthing get done. Perhaps all the money the govt was going to give to bass pro could be used for an underground lot because a surface lot would really trash up the whole idea.

Lets demolish the old Aud very soon so that the site can be ready for future redevelopment. No reason for any delay.

As far as Bass Pro goes, clearly we all have Bass Pro Fatigue. Let them build a store but ONLY using all their own money$$$

PS to Sally: navel is a belly button or type of orange...If Bass Pro doesn't want the Aud, maybe a Belly Button Hall of Fame would be an appropriate venture. Brittney could host the grand opening.

you have a hot dog stand in you back yard! cool!

I love it when a plan comes together!

Good god M, listen to what you are saying. You are admittedly excited that we are just giving away this prime real estate and public funds to a single retailer. Think about it further, you are claiming that a giant outdoor sports store is going to attract countless people to downtown. OK...Lets say that it does....are those people who go to Bass Pro because of their love for hunting and fishing then going to be the same people who decide to stay in the city, enjoying other shops, restaurants and nightlife, and much less, be interested in living in the city???? Furthermore, how in the world does a hunting and fishing store benefit the residents of the city and downtown???

Then M, you proceed to complain that all this land is under the skyway, so no one will develop it anyways, except for the Bass Pro that we bring in. If this is true, then why on earth would you give away the one major portion of the site that is not in the shadow of the skyway, which, according to you, would be best fit for private development. If the city pays Bass Pro millions to build on such a prime real estate site, do you really think other major retailers are going to be attracted to inferior sites without also making major demands from the city???

That 'greenspace' was only intended to be temporary. It was only labeled as such, but the land was parceled off in hopes of a private developer.

"I believe it was reported here that the bridge that will cross the re-earthed canal at the midway point was going to be installed in mid Novermber....No bridge yet."

Ken -- the bridge contractor decided it was easier to assemble it at their yard on Ganson Street on the Buffalo River and then barge it to the site and set it into place. Take a drive down Ohio Street through the Ward toward the Outer Harbor and look to your right -- you'll see a bow-string truss bridge. Pretty cool.

I would love to see this combined with other national retailers. Imangine coming downtown to SHOP again..How amazing that will be. If not Bass Pro, just get something BIG down here, please!

J...Thanks for the update. I will do that next week.

Wait!!! What if they have to raze the skyway?

Start the petition now!!!!!! SAVE THE SKYWAY!!!

www.savetheskyway.com

This is Buffalo, anything can happen.

I wish they would forget about Bass Pro and put that 66 million dollars of our tax money to a better use than this glorified bubba and beaufort bait and tackle shop. It is time to pull the plug on this idiotic idea that Bass Pro wants to come to Buffalo, nothing could be further from the truth.

There are no new surface lots going down there, no matter where Bass Pro or other retailers end up. Give the ECHDC at least that much credit.

So please stop the "suface lot" hysteria and move on.

Using up that big empty "green" space for this project will be a great change to that plan. Buffalo does not nee a big dead wind swept plaza at that site.

Hey if Bass Pro doesnt want the aud then they are just another retailer and they dont deserve all those subsidies which I thought was stupid for a retailer anyway...

and who the heck thought there should be a park there? Bring back the density of the turn of the century wharf with all its gas lights and cobblestone streets and small 2-3-4 story brick warehouse buildings perfect for retail, offices and residential.

bring back the street grid too get rid of the church street exits from I90 & Route 5 downtown get the bridges built to the outer harbor from Main or Pearl or Michigan rebuild the DLW Concourse connect it to the Erie Canal Wharf

as far as the Aud is concerned....its located far enough from the aud keep the facade and build a 10 or 20 story mixed use building in the center....or replace the roof with a glass atrium and emulate the Ellicott Square Building with shops around the periphery. It could be the equivalent of the 1920s version 1890s Ellicott Square Building.

No matter what happens we dont need more parkland and we dont need to spend money on a smaller Bass Pro Store in a different location.

the green space was going to occupied by rows of trees, stone bands denoting historic property boundaries, wood boradwalk along the water, and an iris garden at the historic prime slip. the program was essentially a place for "buffalo rocks the harbor" or other public gatherings formal or informal. to build on this parcel means that the building needs to attractive on 4 sides ( continuous public access all four sides- this can not be a shanghi reds - not in erie basin marina where all land is privitized- must be public-4 sides), multiple stories, multiple entrances (at each corner min- elsewhere as well -need other retail spaces in same building to make work), cut in two to provide access from Hanover street to the water (Hanover is the street that connects directly from Main Street- could provide elevated walk between halves of bass pro), be articulated such that it looks like 4 or 5 buildings, removed from accessable parking ( you can not build parking ramps on the adjacent parcels with the skyway - surface lots only option- but not really an option), minimum service access (typical service not available with narrow cobblestone streets- semis are too large), have minimum outdoor display as there is little room other than maye a pier in the south basin to show boats - no room to show rvs or whatever, AND be adaptable to future uses when bass pro realizes market is over saturated, essentially not be a Johnny Morris Bass Pro Shops Outdoor World. Unless Bass Pro wants to create an entirely unique store that will cost as much as rehabing the aud, this won't work.

Why do we have to be so friggin retarded when it comes to development. Let me get this straight.....we are creating this large, attractive, historic, harborfront area as a means to a)provide good public access to the water and b) to spur major economic development....right? Why the hell then, are we just giving away the prime real estate parcels to a couple of huge entities, nearly all on the public dime. The first location was all of the land at the north western corner of where the canal and river meet that has gone to the naval museum. Yes, i think the museum is great, but this was probably the most prime spot to lure private investment, and the museum could have gone anywhere else. Now, we want to eliminate the other side of the canal, along the water for a big box, which will have its grand entrance on one side and probably nothing on the three others, and much of this will be done with public subsidy!

How the hell do we ever expect to successfully develop the waterfront if we give away all of the prime, developable land for really nothing in return.

Are other companies really going to be banging down the door to locate facing the asscrack of BassPro?

Hey Ken

Have you ever hired a contracter to do anything. Even the smallest jobs do not finish on time. Never and it does not matter where you live.

I'm going off on a tangent here, but does any project in this city ever stay on schedule. I believe it was reported here that the bridge that will cross the re-earthed canal at the midway point was going to be installed in mid Novermber....No bridge yet. There was supposed to be new signage down there describing the ongoing work right after the first of the year...no signage yet.

Is anybody ever accountable during these types of projects??

If Bass Pro opts out of the Aud, then the government aid should be cut substantially! Then they should look at a NEW CONVENTION CENTER! (remember all that talk a few years ago?) A new state-of-the-art center would draw large events with out of towners to the newly refurbished waterrfront! It would also allow the city to demolish the current concrete box between Franklin and Pearl to re-establish the original street grid!

Steel...in regards to the "real story" today. Have you checked lately to find out the whereabouts of the great Jeffrey Skolnick who several years ago was going to be the biomed savior at the UB life sciences facility? Not sure? He is long gone.

These research recruits come and go like ships in the night. When one makes a difference here in Buffalo, let me know. Until then, I'll take a wait and see attitude.

I think that is exactly what most of us want, nick. Are busy streets with retail and activity. I would love for all of downtown and surrounding neighborhoods to have the same idea. But seems, most of the local leaders have never left Buffalo to see what a true city is, to witness real urban streets with PEOPLE and ACTIVITY on the streets EVERYDAY 24/7, cities that are not car dominated with fast roads and highway entrance and exits in the heart of the downtown core, think adding more surface lots are some kind of "progress", letting all businesses shut down at 5pm and wonder "gee, why is Downtown is so dead after 5pm?", letting the owners of the only city mall to rot and dye, want to curb violence with out adding JOBS and doing things the "old school way" for EVERYTHING IN THIS TOWN , that has never worked, but yet, it's a new face telling us it can, so it must work this time....political greed, hiring inside the "Circle" not caring for the people they represent, but for thier own needs. "Yeah, let's raise taxes and not give any more services out. Let's shut down everything while we raise fees and taxes. Let's not give money to the Tourism Bureau- Who needs visitor's here anyway?"

Till these changes are made, I see no real hope for this city, I see it still trying to survive from the small guy while the powers that be shit all over it.

Ken:

Directly from the GA Tech website:

"Jeffrey Skolnick, Ph.D., a renowned systems biologist and previously director of the Buffalo Center of Excellence in Bioinformatics at SUNY-Buffalo, will join the faculty of the Georgia Institute of Technology (Georgia Tech) this spring as the Georgia Research Alliance Eminent Scholar in Computational Systems Biology. "

I wouldn't say he's long gone. He left last spring, not in 1993. And he wouldn't be the first person to leave Buffalo for a better job in Atlanta.

To get anything accomplished -

Step 1: Let benderson start investing his 60 million

Step 2: Immediatly start the demolishion of the aud for a prime site marketed to every developer/corporation from buffalo to manchester

Step 3: Bass Pro development should have been this all along, not a silver bullet anchor but just a piece of a puzzle complimenting other small/mediun sized developments, drawing in a diverse demographic range of people from sportsman to an espn sportszone to movie goers with a imax movie theater, to various restaurants/nightclubs including everything from national chains to local influences, and most importantly including enough space for people to walk, excercise, dock their boats and enjoy a unique waterfront experience.

Buffalo, lets get real and get this done already!

I knew exactly where Skolnick went to. My point was, with all the hype he receved when he came here(which was far greater than this new recruit), what was his legacy here in WNY.

DGard, I just hope the inevitability of building a new convention center is down the priority list, unfortunitly I don't think city leadership has any clue as to how the city should be redeveloped. $66 million to one retailer, seems like a lot of money that could be used on economic development for multiple projects. If a new cc is to be built, why not revisit plans for putting it in the cobblestone district? At least then it's footprint would be out of the way of the "walkable" canal district.

For an article on the realities of a convention center as an economic catalist see: http://www.brookings.edu/metro/pubs/20050117_conventioncenters.htm

The residents of Granger Place will fight this with every fiber of our being.

Buffalo:

Stop begging and prostrating yourselves to "bass pro".

Take back the mone, and tell them to either put up or take a hike.

There are more useful ways the PUBLIC money could be used as mentioned in other posts above than to keep it tied up for YEARS for this one NON-PERFORMING "developer" who judging only by their track record, is a miserable FAILURE.

nimby...the granger place jokes in every thread are getting just a little stale.

Bass Pro is retail, and retail is fine - for what it is. BUT: understand that retail is only a way to SPEND money, not EARN it. Without money coming from outside the area, which allows people to build wealth, any new retailer will be just another way to dissipate cash.

We need to bring in ore and make iron, bring in cotton and make clothes, bring in concepts and make plans, bring in tourists and make them happy, etc.