Buffalo Rising Online

Steel...can you get your hands on a similar video promoting the Main St. Rail in Buffalo if such a video exists? That would be awesome to see how the now regretaable project was pitched to Buffalonians back then.

I agree with al-allo that the Metrorail didn't help downtown like originally promised and the writing was on the wall long before that. However, Main Street now offers a unique opportunity to develop a residential/commercial area free from cars, buses and trucks. If the city focuses on bringing apartments and CONDOS to the Main Steet cooridor, people could live in an urban setting unlike any other....hopefully they don't make a second mistake by trying to bring traffic back to lower main.

good article, Steel.

Slightly off-topic, but I want to disprove the old "Metro Rail killed downtown retail" meme once and for all. It's among Buffalo's great myths, just like the casino Frank Sinatra was going to build in Niagara Falls, the sinking Walden Galleria, the Ellicott Complex design being based on the plans for a French prison, and the 1969 Pontiac GTO Judge with 20 miles on the odometer what was owned by a kid who was shipped off to Vietnam and killed in combat, that is now sitting in his parents' garage in West Seneca, and they refuse to sell it.

The common belief is that "metro Rail killed downtown retail, because people couldn't see the stores from their cars", but it's a bit more complex then that. No Buffalo-based department store chain ever closed just their downtown Buffalo store, while leaving the suburban stores open. The changing face of retail, with smaller chains going bankrupt and the survivors being consolidated into larger national chains, ultimately killed retail in downtown Buffalo. A minor factor was the changing demographics in some city neighborhoods. From the late 1980s through the 1990s, many once-comfortable but solidly working class and lower middle-class neighborhoods -- Polonia, St. John Kanty, Kensington, Delavan-Bailey and Riverside -- experienced massive socioeconomic transition. The residents of those neighborhoods, making up a good part of downtown retail's customer base, fled to the suburbs. A suburban location didn't guarantee success for a chain, as the following shows:

W.T. Grant: entire chain closed; not just the downtown store. The national chain went bust, and the downtown store closed about 1978, along with every other Grant's in the nation.

Sattler's: entire chain closed; not just the downtown store. small low-end full-service department store chain with three stores. The downtown store closed around 1982, along with the other two stores (one at the very popular Boulevard Mall, the other in an inner city neighborhood). The Sattler's store in Boulevard Mall became a Hengerer's (see below).

Hens and Kelly: entire chain closed; not just the downtown store. local mid-end, locally owned department store chain with about ten stores. The chain went bust in the mid-1980s. Their suburban stores were usually located in 1950s-era outdoor plazas or malls that were then dying; they weren't in the bigger, more popular malls. The downtown store was the last in the chain to close. Some suburban stores were reused by AM&As; others sat vacant for years and were demolished or converted to other uses.

L.L. Berger: entire chain closed; not just the downtown store. high-end, locally-owned department store chain with about five stores. The entire chain went bust in the late 1980s. The downtown store was the last in the chain to close, in 1991. The stores in the suburbs weren't later occupied by national department store chains; the buildings were divided into smaller retail spaces and leased to smaller stores.

Hengerer's: upper mid-end, locally owned department store chain with about ten stores. The chain was sold to the Rochester-based Sibley's chain in the mid-1980s. The downtown store was closed in 1989, before the Sibley's chain was absorbed into Kauffmans.

Adam Meldrum and Anderson: middle-end, locally-owned department store chain with about 15 stores. The chain was sold to Pennsylvania-based Bon Ton in 1994. Bon Ton promised to keep the downtown store, but a year later decided to close the 300,000 square foot flagship; the chain's policy was "we don't do downtowns". Bon Ton even closed their flagship store in downtown York, Pennsylvania. A Toronto businessman opened an upscale department store in the former AM&As building in 1998 (Taylor's), but it failed a year later.

What about the large junior department stores downtown?

Kleinhans: entire chain closed; not just the downtown store.

Woolworth's: entire chain closed; not just the downtown store.

There were other department stores in the city limits in the 1970s, too; a giant Sears store north of downtown, The Sample in North Buffalo, and the flagship Kobackers and Sattler's stores in Polonia. Sears closed most of their urban stores nationwide in the 1970s; Buffalo's huge Sears store closed in 1980. The Sample chain died in 1990 (city store was the last one to close; the previous owner of the chain died, and the children didn't want to run the business). The Kobackers and Sattlers chains both went bust, with suburban and city stores closing. Flint and Kent, a very upscale downtown department store that is increasingly lost to history, closed int he late 1950s. The high-end Jenss chain died off without having a single store in the city limits.

During the time downtown Buffalo lost much of its retail base, more prosperous cities also lost their downtown department stores; Denver, Kansas City, Dallas and Houston come to mind. Even Rust Belt cities without transit malls lost downtown department stores; Cleveland, Rochester, Syracuse, Toledo and Detroit. Also there's no transit mall that can be blamed for the death of Como Mall, Seneca Mall, and Thruway Mall, and the closure of suburban department store branches like the Hengerer's/Sibleys in Eggertsville and AM&As in University Plaza.

Retail in downtown Buffalo was a victim of general trends in the retail industry -- poorly managed local chains (where all stores closed, not just city locations), and national chains that "didn't do downtowns" which bought out locals -- and the decline of the region as a while. The impact of the transit mall was minimal. Nonetheless, outside of cities that have a temperate climate, I think pedestrian malls are a horrid idea, for many reasons.

watch the youtube video liked in the article, then click on the "Rochester city of poverty" in the related videos link after. it is great and it paints a much more accurate picture of downtown rochester. my humble opinion buffalo is moving forward as long as we tread carefully (route 5,190,canal,)things will get better. you just cant deny the increase in investment in the city no matter what the negitive commenters would have you believe. more progress is needed before people will return.but it will happen.

re: my previous post. its funny as hell!!!!!!!!!!!!!

sorry for the repeat post? re: re: "rochester city of poverty " video is a spoof of the original that is funny as hell!!! NOW I MUST WORK!!!!

Dan and Denizen...Are you saying that it is just coincidence that many businesses failed shortly after the introduction of the rail system to Main St? National retailers moved away from down town because of decreased revenue. What do you think caused the decreased revenue? Could it be lack of accessability for their customers? If you are correct that the chains failed univerally then if nothing else, the rail prevented national outlets from coming in once the locals shut down.

Denizen...You are correct in that the rail would have been more effective had it reached further into the suburbs. Unfortunately the city did a half assed job. The rail system as it stands today is a miserable failure. It's time to cut losses and open Main back up to automobiles. I would be thrilled if the NFTA used the old rail system operated on by South Buffalo Railway to reach out to the southtowns but will that ever happen? The northtown expansion area is going to become patio homes. The rail is a huge disappointment.

You raise an interesting point Steel. But like all fads what's "in" today is "out" tomorrow. And I'm sure the ECSB was torn down because it was seen as a big dark hulking mass of brick and stone from the past. Personally, I don't mind this midtown bldg (seen it a few times up close). It is very 60s. The video is amazing. Notice how well dressed everyone is. I wonder what became of that around the world carousel.Now how this point generated all the comments about metro rail is beyond me but I'll throw in my $.02. I think metro rail needs to be expanded to be better used and more convenient for people. It is too limited now.

It looks like a picture of UB North. We know how hapening that place is!

Thank god the Buffalo Inner Loop has halted, We'd have even more of a mess to deconstruct.

> Dan and Denizen...Are you saying that it is just coincidence that many businesses failed shortly after the introduction of the rail system to Main St? National retailers moved away from down town because of decreased revenue. What do you think caused the decreased revenue? Could it be lack of accessability for their customers? If you are correct that the chains failed univerally then if nothing else, the rail prevented national outlets from coming in once the locals shut down.

Yes, it's a coincidence.

1) National department store chains generally "don't do downtowns", except in very limited cases. Consider downtown Denver someday; a very affluent metropolitan region (think one big Amherst with two million people) with a healthy downtown that is vibrant year 'round; lots of foot traffic, even long after work hours and on weekends. There's quite a bit of retail in downtown Denver, and a lot of it national chains, but there are no department stores. Not even downtown Los Angeles, Atlanta, Houston, or Phoenix have full-service department stores.

When Macy's bought the Lazarus chain in 2003, one of the first things they did was close the profitable downtown Columbus store. In the eyes of national retailers, ir's not enough for a store to be making a profit; it has to be making a large profit, or else the store is considered "underperforming", closed, and the assets shifted elsewhere where a greater return on investment can be made. Downtown department stores no longer serve their function as a "flagship" when a local chain is absorbed into a national chain. A downtown department store may be profitable, but if it's less profitable than suburban stores, it'll be closed. National department store chains don't keep stores open for sentimental reasons.

2) "The rail prevented national outlets from coming in once the locals shut down." Nope. Remember, through the 1990s, after acquiring local chains, the national chains closed most of their downtown stores EVERYWHERE, whether there was a transit mall or not; not just in Buffalo.

There have only been only a couple new downtown department stores built in the entire country in the past decade; Circle Centre Mall

There are onlya few mid-sized cities in the United States with downtown department stores; Portland, Seattle, Minneapolis, Milwaukee, Indianapolis, Salt Lake City, Pittsburgh and Cincinnatti. That's about it. Buffalo, Rochester, Syracuse, Albany, Cleveland, Akron, Dayton, Kansas City, Columbus, Sacramento, Fresno, Memphis, Louisville, Memphis, Orlando, Tampa, Charlotte, Raleigh, Denver, Albuquerque, Tucson, Austin, El Paso, Des Moines, Richmond, Jacksonville, Las Vegas, Colorado Springs, Omaha, Birmingham ... nothing. No transit malls in most of those cities, either.

From http://www.enquirer.com/editions/2004/01/17/biz_lazarusdowntown17.html

""Most cities struggle to support full-line department stores downtown because the demographics have changed and they don't have the population density," Wayne Hood, an equity analyst who follows Federated for Prudential Equity Group, said. "As a shareholder, we like to see those underperforming stores closed and the capital used in more productive ways."

But Kurt Barnard, chief economist and president of Barnard's Retail Trend Report in New Jersey, said that in today's competitive marketplace, most department store chains couldn't afford to carry the burden of even marginally-performing stores.

"No store can afford to have such a millstone around its neck," Barnard said.

Today, most department store operators, including Federated, are in the process of revamping their stores with new technology and merchandise and closing stores to cut costs and save money. "

I wouldnt chuckle to hard over the rochester poverty video because what I saw is pretty transparent with parts of buffalo, or any city for that matter.

A blog on the development http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=139580

Dan....

Touche

Now I need to find something else to blame for the demise of down town.

Steel, I have really enjoyed reading your thoughtful and astute article on My Fair City, and the resulting commentary. In January I was involved in a weekend-long downtown planning charrette, which not only included a rethinking of the Midtown complex, but also took place there (a small benefit of all the now-vacant space). In 2005 we brought in the Urban Land Institute specifically to look at Midtown and its surroundings, which first got us looking seriously at razing some or all of the complex.

Along with many cities, we've come to regret many of the planning and development dogmas which we embraced perhaps too wholeheartedly, in hindsight. There can be such a thing as being too far ahead of the curve. Now we envy a community like Troy, for example, which was at the end of the line when urban renewal money was being doled out - and as a result retained block after block of delightful Victorian streetscape.

In addition to Midtown, we're also looking at reconfiguring some of that sunken highway you mention - the Inner Loop - which to our detriment cuts off residential neighborhoods from downtown (and which is so quiet on weekends that recently we've been shutting it down for roller blading and biking). In fact, my neighborhood is taking the lead on the effort to convert a section to an at-grade boulevard. Along those lines, we're watching closely Buffalo's battle over the Southtowns Connector - getting that project right, as the community overwhelmingly supports (the Common Council unanimously) will set an important precedent for all of us upstate cities looking to build a better day.

I agree with the people saying the metro rail isn't fully to blame. Besides, the removal of cars and the long construction duration both only worked to hasten the abandonment of downtown by retail - retail followed the residential development, and the that wasn't occuring downtown.

The LRRT really does get a bad rap. Few realize that for years, the ridership numbers have been the type that other cities could only hope for. I don't have the time to pull census data, but a hell of alot of people live within a 1/4 mile walk of the rail line, or even closer to a bus line that takes you directly to a subway station. No matter where you live, if using public transportation is important to you, you can't live wherever you want. The government shouldn'y pay to construct a rail line to your doorstep in the Town of Tonawanda.

The problem around here is not that people can only get places by driving, it's that they PREFER to drive.

Here is what I can say about Rochester. It has managed to keep a significant amount of its wealth and technology. It has stable entrepreneurs, small businesses and a significant presence of Fortune 500 companies that any city would envy.

But Rochester is not a city in any sense of the word and never will be a city in any sense of the word. The majority of Rochester was demolished and stands about modestly better than Niagara Falls or Syracuse. If you think Buffalo is choked off by the Kensington, the I-190, the Niagara Expressway and the Elm-Oak Arterial then Buffalo looks absolutely spacious compared to Rochesters Inner Loop and 490 which act as both a noose and dagger through a city already devastated by urban renewal.

Midtown can go..and they can build an office building but the fundamentals of Rochester are simple...it is a city of snoots and snouts that is a city only in name of marketing....rather it is an aglomeration of suburbs and small towns interconnected by wegmans shopping malls and suburban office parks.

Conversely Buffalo may not have the money or the technology that Rochester has but it does have a central city and a significant portion of its historic structure and it retains its a sense of urbanity and diversity that rochester can only match in fictitious marketing.

Cars back on main street won't help but a great mass transportation system would. Metro rail needs to be finished, extend it out main to the North Campus and spur to airport as was origanal intention. A second "ring" line should still be considered that circles the urban core. Complete all this with Middle Class apartments downtown and I think your off and running... (pointing to Toronto - SEE?)